Jared schrieb:
> "Good Habit" wrote in message
>
> It's been a while since I wrote the relevant DoD post (#70 was posted 2
> years ago, more or less. Wow. Has it been that long?) but if I recall
> correctly, what I had in mind was an ATL younger brother of Pedro II of
> Brazil.
Of course there would be a small problem here - if ATL Miguel I of
Portugal is a male child born instead of OTL's Maria II, he of course is
an _older_ brother of Pedro II of Brazil. If this other *Miguel than
would be a younger brother of the same Pedro, this Miguel's would
actually be brothers - even for royals, to name to brothers identically
is a bit to confusing...
>> I always interpreted 'create a united Spain' as something including
>> Portugal, and thus under the Portuguese King. (A 'united Spain' - without
>> Portugal - at least formally existed since many centuries - to establish a
>> government that would - again - have authority over all of it wouldn't be
>> a new _creation_ - and thus couldn't be meant, IMO).
>
> It may perhaps have been poor wording on my part, but the 'create a united
> Spain' part was meant to be a reference to the fact that in the Spanish
> Civil War which preceded it, the country was in fact de facto divided into
> two nations anyway. 'Re-create a united Spain' would probably have been
> better. Unification of Portugal and Spain at this point would have been a
> complete non-starter. Of course, a cunning King of Portugal may have
> allowed it to go ahead as a proposal for reasons of gaining 'compensation'
> instead - see below.
>
>> (I'm well aware that most Portuguese would certainly be opposed to it, and
>> that they would find it especially insulting to call such a combined state
>> simply 'Spain' - but that's not a reason why Britain wouldn't call it that
>> way - it could hope to win an (at best semi stable) ally against France).
>> [The reduced stability of such a construct being one of the 'assets' from
>> a British POV, IMO, making the country more vulnerable to British
>> meddling].
>>
>> OTOH, Dom Miguel, brother of Pedro IV - doesn't make much sense...
>>
>> 1) If you stick to the exact same lifespan for Saldanha as IOTL, although
>> he has a significantly changed career, you might as well do the same for
>> Miguel. But IOTL, Miguel died in 1866 - so he would be out as King in
>> 1872...
>>
>> 2) even if he lives longer - forwarding the candidature of an elderly
>> prince - approaching 70 - who most likely never played a significant role
>> IATL - makes no real sense at all - there certainly isn't a shortage of
>> 'underemployed' princes of younger age.
>
> Yes, I certainly had someone younger in mind than that.
>
>> So it would make perfect sense - from a British POV - to propose a union
>> of Portugal and Spain under the Portuguese King, restoring Britains
>> position as the countries main protector. And the opposition of the other
>> parties to this deal could serve as pretext to offer Portugal _quite
>> generous compensation_ for the failed union (Galicia + Ceuta?). (without a
>> _need for compensation_ - Portugal might regain Olivenca - but nothing
>> else).
>
> Hmm. This would require some minor retconning, but that could quite easily
> be worked out to have been the original plan all along. If Miguel of
> Portugal realises that his own people won't accept the unified crown, then
> some chicanery is in order. Don't publicly reject the British proposal, but
> instruct Saldanha (and the rest of his delegation) to obstruct it. This
> gives the pretext for being offered the 'compensation' of Galicia. Maybe.
>
This could, IMO, circumnavigate the question *why* Portugal got a
significant junk of land at all - that big powers participate in grabs
is quite common, but that minor powers are allowed this as well is not
that usual - except the big powers initially considered this a way to
make them dependent - firmly allied.
So IF Britain intends to bring Portugal firmly back in to London's
orbit, it might favor such a large - but probably not that stable -
union. OTOH, the 'compensation' of Galicia might not really serve that
purpose - so why any big power should have supported it in the first
place would escape me - but as a 'compensation' - after someone in the
foreign office in London made grandiose promises to the King of
Portugal, it could may be pass... |
